Non european manufactured Cars = Shit

[jmualfaracer]

American Cars are grossly over-rated in the US. The only selling features are that they have such terrible fuel inefficientcy that 35 minutes of racing will drain the entire tank- and that's on a good day.
They are revered among idiots who only have the balls to race against idiots in civics in the US. The typical muscle car has such poor suspension that your spine will need surgery if you take it off a flat road for ten minutes. They are noisy, but not a nice, purring noise. More like the noise you get when you fart underwater.
For the most part, they are really ugly. The typical muscle car fan/designer thinks that being big will divert the atention to the featureless junk that is the chassis. The chassis will typically crumple like the French army in any accident, despite the car being heavier than the arguements against buying it. The muscle car is typical of the stereotyped american car, in that it is large, badly designed, poorly put toghether (with glue), drinks the engine dry in minutes ,over-priced, an engine that is so ridiculous it should be destroyed, heavy and being an all-out joke of a machine.
The typical owner will claim it is good, because it can chase off a few ricers. But of course, a car costing half is usually shit outta luck anyway.

[Mike]

Well hello. I was gonna congratulate you on the well-written piece (although highly inaccurate), but a Google search later and I had found you just copy/pasted it. A unique first post nonetheless.

[.RJ]

Interesting.

Who is this?

[jmualfaracer]

its a fresh topic... suggestion, do i get points off for forgetting to cite it???? did not mean to plagiarize, my apologies if you got offended... still impressed at the lack of negative remarks....

[.RJ]

its a fresh topic... suggestion, do i get points off for forgetting to cite it????

Whats a fresh topic?

still impressed at the lack of negative remarks....

Is that what you were looking for? Probably looking in the wrong place....

[jmualfaracer]

wrong place ?
Americans tend to hold a lot of pride towards the shit their automotive companies manufacture... and since the fast and the furious came out, everybody wants to be a racer... just expressing how pathetic this all seems... but then again a motorsport forum, probably talking to a bunch of wanabee connaiseurs

[CaptainHenreh]

I want to know what "Muscle Cars" you're talking about here.

I mean, the only 3 that I can think of are:

The Chrysler 300C,
The GTO
and The Mustang.

The 300C is as much MB as Chrysler, and the GTO isn't an American design, either. The Fox body is what? 20 years old now? More? So yeah, it's not the peak of chassis engineering.

So, I'm not quite sure what the point of the-article-you-didn't-write is?

[.RJ]

wrong place ?
Americans tend to hold a lot of pride towards the shit their automotive companies manufacture... and since the fast and the furious came out, everybody wants to be a racer... just expressing how pathetic this all seems... but then again a motorsport forum, probably talking to a bunch of wanabee connaiseurs

First, :?:

I have no idea what you're talking about, and you're spelling is atrocious.

If you wanted to have some sort of discussion about the supposed poor quality of american cars (A friend of ours has almost 300K on her camaro and has been autocrossed/tracked since new), then at least do it in an intelligent manner without insulting the group.

[jmualfaracer]

okey posting the article may not have been very precise on my part... how about I rephrase it so you dont get a headache... come to think of it this is a very non debatable topic, chrysler... gto... my point is simple, european manufacturing over any other kind of manufacturing... its as straight foward as car or driver... theres a thought, CAR OR DRIVER???? if you can answer that ill come down a peg or two

[jmualfaracer]

300k on a camaro????!!! dude what a waste... supposed poor quality??? if you have any arguments woth making instead of citing three exceptions that may have been good cars, don't waste your time...
I drive a 2002 alfaromeo 156 GTA
for the size of the engine show me a f'ing comparison worth discussing...
dont tire yourself its not there... german, italian, french = sheer genius... americans should stick to what they know

[.RJ]

okey posting the article may not have been very precise on my part... how about I rephrase it so you dont get a headache...

ok.... If you have something to say, then do it in a clear, concise manner...

come to think of it this is a very non debatable topic, chrysler... gto...

I dont get it. American engineered cars are not bad in any way. Alot of cars are built here (Honda Accords are built in Ohio) and are great.

my point is simple, european manufacturing over any other kind of manufacturing...

Ever seen anyone work on a Audi A4/A6? Its a nightmare of over-engineering. Why the hell do Audi and MB still uses vacuum actuated locks?

its as straight foward as car or driver... theres a thought, CAR OR DRIVER????

And if Chewbacca lives on Endor, you must acquit!

if you can answer that ill come down a peg or two

What peg?

[jmualfaracer]

okey, you just said honda accords are great???? i think this conversation is over

[Sijray21]

i think a lot of the well informed american public are not influenced by the movie The Fast and the Furious. The movie at the very least was mildly entertaining, but hardly. The only thing that the movie did well was promote an industry of aftermarket sales in the import scene. Probably created more jobs and having people spend money on parts for a hobby. Although this hobby has a tendancy to have people in the amateur and professional racing not appreciative the fact remains that what people do to thier cars is subjective. I don't know what this has to do with your original "point of argument" however?

There is pride to be held with the american automotive industry, but there are vehicles out there that have higher build quality.

i doubt we're "wannabee..." and i believe the correct word is connoisseur's, how did you come to that conclusion?

[Mike]

you're bashing reliablility, he gave the accord as an example of an american manufactured car that was reliable. quit picking and choosing what you want to hear. if you wished in incite a heated argument, please go away. while we welcome people with concise and reasonable points, we do not have much patience for the ignorant.

[.RJ]

okey, you just said honda accords are great???? i think this conversation is over

So I suppose that efficient, reliable cars are bad?

[Sijray21]

... my point is simple, european manufacturing over any other kind of manufacturing...

european engineering is good, manufacturing maybe another issue. First off the coding system you generally use, i believe it's called OPITZ, is VERY vague in its descriptions of parts and characteristics. The US coding scheme of DCLASS is much more efficient in its descriptions and easier to use, IMO. Secondly first hand experience with long term exposure with european automobiles over here leaves me with the conclusion that japanese automobiles don't have as many interior problems and engine maintenance as european cars do.

[jmualfaracer]

the word is connaiseur... and I was probably just stereotyping... back to the original argument at hand which ill remind you has nothing to do with muscle cars, car or driver or spending 300 k on a f'ing camaro... you still have no concrete arguments that favor american manufacturing....

[jmualfaracer]

someone took ISAt 331
the us uses opitz too... and very good point... distinction between manufacturing and design...

[.RJ]

back to the original argument at hand which ill remind you has nothing to do with muscle cars, car or driver or spending 300 k on a f'ing camaro...

You dolt. She has 300K miles on her car. Not spent on.

you still have no concrete arguments that favor american manufacturing....

If you want to talk about Manufacturing then maybe you should do some reading up on Japanese lean manufacturing and Kan Ban? Its clearly a more efficient system, and has been adopted by Saturn when they started and GM built a joint factory with Toyota in California to study their systems.

If you want to talk about Engineering then generally German cars are more robust and durable - but they also come with a higher cost (initial and usually maintenance) than most American or Japanese cars.

[Mike]

1. The word is 'connoisseur'
2. Nobody spent $300k on a Camaro, it has 300k miles on the odometer, a testament to something :?

you still have no concrete arguments that favor american manufacturing....

And you still have no concrete arguments against. Quoting the urban dictionary surely doesn't pass as concrete here.